Re: True English

gerardM Lun 14 Avr - 19:43

Hi everyone,

The word "massepain" sounds French.
However, we must not be mistaken by the poor habit of the French to gallicize words they "steal" :-(

The word "massepain" is not French!
Were you interested in the origin, read En Wikipedia or Wikipedia Fr.
As a matter of fact, I discovered this exciting forum "Le forum des Babéliens" today; this forum is working on a subject which is one of ours, no?

Le mot “massepain” est intéressant, car il semble être le résultat de plusieurs étymologies populaires.
La confiserie elle-même est certainement d'origine orientale, méditerranéenne.
L'origine la plus lointaine du mot (persane ou sémitique ?) est obscure et controversée.
En Europe centrale, il s’est introduit via l’italien “marzipane” ou “marzapane”, étymologie populaire du nom oriental de la confiserie déformé, se référant à du “pain” (pane) de “mars”, de “Mars”, de “Marc” voire de “Martial”… selon les goûts des interprètes.
De l’italien, il est passé dans l’allemand (marzipan), le hongrois (marcipán).
En français, il semble être un emprunt plus tardif à une forme de la péninsule ibérique (v. l’espagnol mazapán et le portugais maçapão) et subit une nouvelle déformation d’étymologie populaire, qui donne le mot “massepain”….

Les plus célèbres sont fabriqués actuellement en Sicile, en Allemagne (le fameux “marzipan de Lübeck” à l’appellation contrôlée) et à Tolède.
L’industrie du massepain est très développée en Hongrie où (comme à Tolède) il existe aussi un musée dédié à cette délicatesse.

Might be interesting to keep an eye on this board.

gerardM Mer 30 Avr - 16:36

Hi everyone,

An expression to know: "to be fighting fit" which could be equivalent to our "être d'attaque" (there are oodles of expressions with this meaning, I chose one which sounded similar -boxing domain-).

We know the meaning of "sock" as footwear. However, sock is also a slang word meaning slap.
There's the colloquial verb "to sock" and the expression "sock him one!" that we could translate into "flanque-lui une beigne !"

gerardM Jeu 1 Mai - 14:56

I don't know what politeness is in English.
"Me + chocolate"
This form is the usual one, even with a person: "Me and Molly".
In French, the polite form definitely is "Le chocolat et moi" all the more so with persons : "Molly et moi".

gerardM Ven 2 Mai - 20:12

Hi there.

I received a newsletter from which I took this couple of expressions:

-> Why continuing support for XP is bad math
(the French corresponding expression would be "un mauvais calcul")

-> Things change; it’s past time to move on
(the French corresponding expression would be "il est temps" or "il est grand temps")

gerardM Sam 3 Mai - 21:04

Hi there.

There's a weird word that Norma, my favorite American teacher, taught me: "underdog".

Do you know what it is?

There's no French word.
For example, in the soccer final today between Rennes and Guinguamp, Guinguamp is the underdog.
My Hachette-Oxford dictionary states:

But no, I'm not happy with that dictionary!! It's not exactly that!!

Bab La Dictionary is not good at all:

gerardM Sam 3 Mai - 21:18

Howdy,

Collins is better:

Word Reference is good too:

gerardM Sam 3 Mai - 21:27

> There's no French word.
Yes there's one but the funny is that it is an English word: "outsider" though the usual meaning in English is not this one (underdog) -of course when I give thsi context "in today's soccer final, Guinguamp is the outsider", it's understandable-.

MurielB Sam 3 Mai - 22:43

Hi Gérard everyone !
I knew about the word "underdog" but i didn't know that the"top dog" was the leader or the favourite. Thanks for teaching me.

gerardM Dim 4 Mai - 13:41

Muriel,

Do you think both expressions come after greyhound races that are/were appreciated in the UK?

MurielB Dim 4 Mai - 21:48

Hi Gérard !
I have just read that

"Top dog" and "Under dog" come from the sport of dog fighting. In a dogfight, the winner usually ends up on top, while the loser ends up on the ground

MurielB Dim 4 Mai - 22:26

Gérard a écrit:In English, there are several words (like in French) - I tried to set them in the order of increaasing intimacy:
- peck
- smooch / kissie
- kiss
- tongy or tonguy (I don't know well)... possibly Aussie teenagers' language
- French kiss

We have talked about "American greetings "in "American culture". Gérard mentioned the different words for "Kiss" which I have copied here.

gerardM Lun 5 Mai - 19:35

Hi everyone,

I just wanted to point out that "big" is usually understood as "gros" by French beginners.

Big doesn't mean gros: it's far more than this and the French meaning corresponds to the English fat.
Big has got several meanings... I'd say in all of the directions.

For example when people haven't seen a baby for long, they say it's a big boy/girl while the French say "grand": don't say "tall" unless it grew like an asparagus Wink

.

MurielB Lun 5 Mai - 20:16

Hi Gérard, everyone
I have found funny and interesting expressions with "big"
A big cheese= A very important person
To be in big trouble= You have a lot of problems
Here are more
http://www.goenglish.com/Idioms/Big.asp

A Big Fish In A Small Pond »
(one who succeeds in a small area where there is little competition...)

A Big Frog In A Small Pond »
(one who succeeds in a small area where there is little competition...)

Get A Big Send Off »
(a big party to celebrate that you are leaving; a going-away party...)

Go Over Big With Someone »
(they really liked it...)

Have A Big Mouth »
(that person talks a lot about other people...)

No Big Deal »
(it is okay; it doesn't matter; it is not important...)

The Big Moment »
(The time that you have been waiting for...)

A Little Knowledge Is A Dangerous Thing »
(people who have only a little knowledge about something often make big mistakes because they think they know more than they actually know...)

Batten Down The Hatches »
(prepare for a big storm...)

Better Safe Than Sorry »
(it is better to be careful than to risk making a big mistake...)

Bite Off More Than One Can Chew »
(accept a responsibility which is too big...)

Biting Off More Than You Can Chew »
(taking on a challenge that is too big...)

Foul Up »
(make a big error...)

Get Off Easy »
(one did something wrong but did not receive a big punishment...)

Get Off Lightly »
(one did something wrong but did not get a big punishment...)

In Deep Water »
(in trouble; having big problems that are difficult to solve...)

Loaded For Bear »
(ready for a big fight...)

No Pain, No Gain »
(you must work hard if you want big results...)

Pie In The Sky »
(a big idea which is impossible to make real...)

Square Meal »
(a big, healthy meal...)

Take Effect »
(big to have a result or reaction...)

Take Someone Or Something By Storm »
(arrive with a big noise and lots of activity...)

The Best Laid Schemes Of Mice And Men »
(good plans can go bad; big plans that people make and fill with hopes and dreams...)

Thunder »
(the sound that comes from big clouds in the sky, often after flash of lightning or during rain...)

Work Wonders With Someone Or Something »
(Make a big improvement...)

gerardM Mar 27 Mai - 22:26

Hi everyone,

I tend to claim that English language as more words than French... Okay it depends on the domain (some domain are specifically French such as law, cooking...) but an English-French dictionary is thicker on the English side and English sentences are shorter due to specific words instead of FRench expressions...

An example is the French word "terre".
In place of this word, English people can use, according to the context:
- Earth
- soil
- land
- ground
- dirt
- field
- estate
- terra
- shore
- world
- clay
I might exaggerate a bit... to be fair, to the French "terre", I should add "champ, terrain, sol, rive, etc."

For "enterrer", the English can be: to bury, to inter, to shelve (fig.)
For "déterrer", the English can be: to unearth, to dig up, to exhume.

As usual, we French cannot use any of the words because they are used in specific cases that we have to learn scratch

As I often write, true synonyms are ~~scarse~~/rare.
Look: despite Krystyna's explanations and the dictionary I still don't understand the subtle differences between scarce and rare Laughing

MurielB Mar 27 Mai - 22:46

scarce and rare

I agree, it's difficult to understand the subtleties
>Rare is not common
>scarce : there is not very much of it. scratch

An emerald is rare. Is it scarce ? I don't think so.

gerardM Mer 28 Mai - 23:12

Hi everyone,

There are words that are regional.

A word that is frequently needed in conversation is "to think" (FR "penser").

In the United States, instead of think, they often use "guess".

US (suppose) supposer; (believe, think) penser, croire; I guess (that) what he says is true je suppose que ce qu'il dit est vrai; I guess (that) I must be going now il faut que je m'en aille maintenant; ‘he's right, you know’—‘I guess so’ ‘il a raison, tu sais’—‘oui, je suppose’; ‘you can't be sure’—‘I guess not’ ‘tu ne peux pas être sûr’—‘non, effectivement’.

In Australia, instead of think, they often use "reckon"; reckon exists in British English but in Oz it's used more often; for example, you could often hear "What'ya reckon?" (instead of what do you think?).
( Australian Slang )

MurielB Mer 28 Mai - 23:29

In Australia, instead of think, they often use "reckon";

Thanks Gérard, I didn't know !

gerardM Dim 8 Juin - 0:28

Hi there.

This morning, I heard that JEEP was an acronym but I don't remember.

As I'm trying to find out on Internet, I read:
- it's not an acronym (Wikipedia) but a backronym ie made up afterwards.
JEEP would come from GP-Government Purpose which led to the pronounced 2 letters as JEEP
- as usual, EMTs love to play with the words and we can find oodles of funny backronyms such as:
--- Just Empty Every Pocket
--- Just Enough Education to Perform
--- Just Eats Every Part
--- Just Expect Every Problem
--- Joint Emergency Evacuation Plan
--- Just Enough Essential Parts (that's what I heard this moring from teh radio)
--- Justice, Economy, Environment, and Peace
--- Joseph Ejercito Estrada for President
--- etc
LOL tons of meanings!!

Tregouet Mer 11 Juin - 12:21

They use reckon in the south of the US quite often.
Reckon y'all ain't from around here ;-)

As for guess/think/suppose, you could say that I guess versus I think has more to do with the amount of doubt, to say "I guess so" has an almost questioning tone to it, or apathy.

gerardM Mer 11 Juin - 15:48

Hi Tregouet,

Thanks for your words.
"To guess", "to reckon" and "to think" exist in English and are used in the UK, in the States, in Oz but what I wanted to point out was that they didn't have exactly the same meaning.
- to guess, in the States, is more used than in the UK, even with the simple meaning of "to think" or "to believe" or let's say a Brit would say "I think that..." when an American would say "I guess that..."
- to reckon, in Australia, is more used than in the UK, even with the simple meaning of "to think" or "to believe" or let's say a Brit would say "What do you think?" while an Aussie would say "What d'ya reckon?".

PS: Of course, feel free to criticize and comment on my mistakes.

gerardM Jeu 12 Juin - 23:32

Hi Tregouet,

Similarly to what I wrote in [Am.English] American culture

Hi Tregouet,

I think I opened this thread.

The title "American culture" was chosen for French readers... of course, there is not only one "American culture" and as you are a member of the forum, I regret this title: in this thread, I just wanted to point out some American features that would surprise French people and that they have to ba aware of.

I must say that you might be in disagreement with what was written in the prensent topic...
As you know, English taught in France is way too simple and the French are not good at English. If we spoke a language as it is taught (too close to perfect grammar), we would be a bit rediculous.
In this thread, I wanted to point out our schoolish English was far from spoken language: here too, my title was not the best one Sad

Again, feel free to disagree with what I wrote.

gerardM Mar 29 Juil - 23:36

Hi everyone,

I'm posting in this thread not because it's really "True English" but because I learned something recently that I want to share with you all.

My New-Zealander cousin was discussing with another EMT and I could catch "I'm rearing to meet you!".
As I didn't know this expression well (I thought Iunderstood by the context), I searched information.

- "I'm rearing to meet you" is correct and I had understood correctly: it's close to "I'm looking forward to meeting you!"
- it refers to a horse that gets up on his back legs and who can be said wanting to do something
- if noun and adjective "rear" are pronounced rI@(r), in "rearing" the "i" is not heard and is rather pronounced rerIN but I've got French ears which means that I might be wrong.

gerardM Jeu 28 Aoû - 15:31

Hi evryone,

A stupid challenge around me these days!

It consists in receiving a large bucket full of ice (and icy water) on the head and body, in filming and posting on Facebook.
Then you challenge other persons to do so withing 24 hours.

Did thoust challenge me to an Ice Bucket Alison? I's accept! As well as doing this challenge, I'm also donating to ALS (or MND), and I encourage you all to do the same. I nominate Suzanne Clancy Jack Miller (I said Tom in the video - I meant his brother ) Natàlia Costa Cano and all you Perpenders! You guys have 24 hours!

Funny?

MurielB Jeu 28 Aoû - 22:15

very stupid and dangerous challenge indeed

gerardM Jeu 28 Aoû - 22:47

Let me introduce my great-nephew to you -> https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10152336641307469&set=vb.632197468

... and his family through the comments; they are expecting my great-niece to join (it's his mother who challenged Matt)... as you can see, it's not a teenage gamble! scratch