True English

Hi Guilaine,

It may be easy for you or other French persons but it's horrible for me.

It makes me think of exercises Norma (my favorite American teacher) gave me: listen to hundreds of speeches pronounced by hundreds of different voices and accents throughout the world - several parts of the US, several parts of the UK, Ireland, Scotland, India, Indonesia, Japan, Australia, South Africa, even foreigners, ladies, men, children, high-pitched, low-pitched, angry, laughing, shouting, whispering... in background noises...
Terrible!
Her conclusion was that I understood better British voices (which I didn't like )

I was exhausted after such sessions.

Fortunately, American friends told me they also had difficulties with the southern accents of the United States, or Australian accent, or Japanese voices...

Bonjour à tous,

Une chose qui différencie l'enseignement/l'éducation anglaise de la française...

J'en étais conscient sur le sol américain mais nous en avons discuté hier avec Kevin, un Australien de notre Roundtable.
Que ce soit aux Etats-Unis, au Royaume-Uni ou en Australie et d'une manière générale dans tous les pays de langue anglaise, ils ont beaucoup d'exercices de prise de parole en public.
Les étudiants ont très souvent à exposer et défendre leur position devant la classe ce qui en fait des locateurs sûrs d'eux devant un public et devant la contradiction.
J'ai eu l'occasion de travailler avec des Américains et ils sont redoutables car lorsqu'ils parlent, ils ont un ton très assuré, très persuasif si bien que les Français les qualifient d'arrogants !

Kevin nous disait hier qu'un exercice quasi-quotidien est d'être répartis en groupes de 4, un sujet de discussion leur est donné et 2 étudiants doivent défendre un point de vue et les 2 autres, le point de vue opposé ; ils ont une heure pour étudier, trouver leurs arguments ; ils sont désignés pour défendre une position indépendamment de leur vraie opinion (ce qui est encore une autre forme de l'exercice : défendre le point de vue opposé à celui auquel on croit réellement).

> si bien que les Français les qualifient d'arrogants !
Bien sûr les Américains ne se trouvent pas arrogants pour 2 sous mais par contre, ils trouvent les Français très arrogants
En effet, les Français sont beaucoup plus précis dans leurs études que ce soit pour la grammaire, pour les sciences, etc. et lorsque nous parlons, nous donnons aisément l'impression de "tout savoir" et nous admettons difficilement la contradiction ou même la mise en doute (généralement nous ne parlons pas pour ne rien dire mais lorsque nous sommes sûrs alors que, comme exposé ci-dessus, les Américains sont formés pour subir la contradiction et pour savoir répondre avec assurance -même pour bluffer-).

~~

Je parlais là de mon expérience professionnelle mais certains Français sont également doués pour la négociation et la diplomatie.

ils ont beaucoup d'exercices de prise de parole en public.

Gérard je pense que pour bien parler en public, il faut s'entrainer et c'est pour cela qu'ils sont meilleurs que nous !

Oui Muriel.
Nos politiciens doivent se former et un exercice classique est -sans préparation- de parler pendant 1 heure et avec conviction, d'un verre Duralex ; ça apprend à parler pour ne rien dire, à parler mais sans répondre à la question posée, ce que nos politiciens de tous poils doivent savoir faire !

Gérard we have already mentioned that language on "Le café polyglotte sur le net"
PRATIQUONS ENSEMBLE UNE NOUVELLE LANGUE, EN TOUTE CONVIVIALITE, SANS PRISE DE TETE !

Hi everyone,

I'll publish its link as soon as I can find it on the Web...

A few days ago, I received an email from my nephew, who has been in the Emirates for 30 years (he's the husband of Alison, my New-Zealander niece, and the father of dancers - I often post about them).
Jean-Clause wrote a report on a congress which just took place in Dubai, gathering colleagues from the entire world.
Jean-Claude is a Senior Landscape Consultant who participated in the Palm Island project of Abou Dabi, a few years ago.

I'm very proud as JC took the best from his Anglo-Saxon environment, showing a good sense of humor all along the article and being able to laugh at his name.

~~

I just would like to point out here teh sense of humor, the ability to laugh at oneself, things that the French definitely unfortunately don't master.

JC took the best from his Anglo-Saxon environment, showing a good sense of humor all along the article and being able to laugh at his name.

Gérard, I think not everyone can laugh at themselves. You have to be strong and self-confident to do so. When I am feeling well, I can do it but when I am not feeling well, I can't.

I didn't lead any stats but laughing at oneself is common from English style educated people (I could see this very often in professional meetings); they are trained; this point is extremely rare from French people.

I already wrote about this. In a professional environment, it's way cleverer to clearly speak about our own mistakes (there are several ways including exaggeration and humor), what to say then? It's very difficult to tell off someone who recognized and described the error (and exposed it with his chosen words).
French people should learn this very convenient feature.

Hi everyone,

In countries with an English style culture, the primary schoof has 6 years and the secondary, 6.
In France, there are 5 years for primary and 7 for secondary.

In the US, the UK, they name the classes from 1 to 12.
In France, we name primary school with specific names (CP CE1 CE2 CM1 CM2 - in the past we used numbers from 11ème to 7ème), secondary school in a reverse order from 6ème to 1ère and Terminale.

Regarding the word College:
As far as I know,
- College in France is a school from 6ème to 3ème
- College in the UK is similar to Uni
- College in the US is High school.

I didn't lead any stats but laughing at oneself is common from English style educated people

Yes Gérard I have noticed it in my English friends. So long as you don't lack self esteem which is not good for your mental stability, you can laugh at your mistakes and no one will blame you for it.
Exaggeration and humor are a good way to do it if you have enough self-confidence.

> enough self-confidence
Training and understanding the convenience help.

The French have to be aware of this, they would be cooler.

Some people are very strong and their  sense of humor is the perfect antidote to any  stressful situation all the more so since they laugh at themselves. (I have seen that sentence in the forum and I find it very good)
They appear "cool". let's try to do it then.

Muriel,

I didn't write about this but the French behaviors don't help our country-fellows: school, heavy consequences of mistakes in a pro environment which rather lead to hide and deny.

I agree that it is very important to acknowledge our errors (Not to be always proud) otherwise we don't make any progress. Is it what you mean Gérard ?

Muriel,

> otherwise we don't make any progress
You are right with your words.

> ... in a pro environment which rather lead to hide and deny
I meant that the consequences of errors in France, are too heavy: it's quickly critics and punishment.
In France, people often say: "it's not my fault!"
The response is so well used, even for tennis that my sons kept laughing: after any lost tennis match Henri Leconte used to complain about the wind, the sun, a hole on the court, etc. rarely/never that he played poorly, less well that his opponent!

In the US -except lies- an error, failure (eg bankrupcy) is not the end, you can get up and try again.

Hi Muriel,

Here is just a pic on the subject, published by "Staying Alive Is Not Enough"





They might read your forum!

Yes it's a very good picture !

Hi Muriel, everyone,

Another point regarding the Anglo-Saxon world:

Tell me what you noticed.
To me...

Australians are the friendliest of the gang. They will quickly give you a nickname probably Kermit I hope you won't feel offended because they don't intend to but it's their style. No problem to have a beer together.
Americans will quickly name you after your first name; don't see anything special.
I'm not used to meeting them but I guess teh Brits will wait till becoming familiar.

Hi everyone,

Avant

Consider the 2 French sentences:
- j'aurai du travail jusqu'à mardi
- je n'aurai pas fini le travail avant mardi.
These sentences are equivalent, right? The French uses 2 different prepositions "jusque" or "avant" depending on positive or negative, right?

Don't apply the French pattern, the English translation is "till" (or until):
- I'll be busy till Tuesday
- my work won't be over till Tuesday.

No "before" in the story!

Another "avant": je viendrai avant Noël -> I'll come by X'Mas
Another one: j'en aurai fini avant 3 mois (with the meaning of a duration, not a date) -> It'll be done within 3 months.

Gérard Everyone !
I didn't know about Kermit the frog,now I know.

I'm glad to have been able to teach you something Muriel.

http://forum.wordreference.com/threads/comparative-and-superlative-of-fun-funny.183086/

Hi everyone,

I don't know if I already posted about this.

The musical notes in English are; "Do, Re, Mi, Fa, So, La, Ti" (also "C D E F G A B")
(in German it's "C D E F G A H")

-> Wikipedia

Gérard I don't think so !

MurielB a écrit:Gérard I don't think so !

LOL What don't you think Muriel?
> I don't know if I already posted about this.
... That I already posted it?
> The musical notes in English are; "Do, Re, Mi, Fa, So, La, Ti" (also "C D E F G A B")
... that the English notes are Do Re Mi Fa Sol La Ti?
... that the English notes are C D E F G A B?
> (in German it's "C D E F G A H")
... that the German notes are C D E F G A H?